Sunday, November 13, 2011

2100 Hundre Orks Project:: Tournament Recap Part 4 of 4

Well, here we come to the meat of the matter and take a look at how the list did in general, what list I should have taken, how I could have improved my generalship, and thoughts on a proper unit of trukk boyz, with some extras thrown in.

Just a fair warning...this is going to be a wall of text post.

Here are some links to help out to catch up to where we are now; Part I (includes my list), Part II, Part III,

How did the list do?

A subjective assessment to be sure as no list exists in a vacuum. How well a list does depends on many things, foremost the skills of the general. If we apply the fact that the general was relatively inexperienced this will let us take a look at which units were easy to use and produced good results...despite average generalship:

Big Mek with KFF: A true "set and forget" unit. Does what he does very well...makes shots bounce off your stuff. It was not difficult to use the footprint of the battle wagon to encompass as many units as possible and roll for 4+'s whenever I was forced. The KFF saved higher than %50 of the hits taken. Worth every point and almost a must have for any vehicle heavy list.

Ghazzy: Ghazzy is a problems solver with his 2+ invul and bunch of attacks. His guaranteed 6" Waagh is a game changer if used correctly. I would say he did his thing in the hands of an inexperienced general. I did not time my Waaghs correctly nor really use him to any where in the upper half of his potential. Thus for me, on this day with my current skill set, he was over costed.   I would have better used and saved points with no war boss or one on a bike.

Burnas with Rokkits: I loved this unit. With a BS2...three shoots is the magical number to get a hit each shooting phase. This they did and glanced/stunned/and damaged their fair share on the day. When they got up close the let loose the burnas for 7 flame templates. NOTE to Ork roles to hit you see! I should have been a bit more brave with them and seen what the power weapon side of the burnas could do. But I had them hop a ride with the mek in the battle wagon game one, and they borrowed the vacant trukk belonging to the Mega Armored Nobs (MAN's) in game two and three....this is where the did very well scooting around flaming anything around. The extra bonus with these guys is the the three Rokkit toting meks have mek tools...that right...I did not attempt to use it but they can take 3 attempts at a 4+ to fix immobilization/weapon destroyed...or one of each, etc. I have plans for these guys in my future vehicle (Mech) heavy lists.

Lootas: Well...they lit up a Vindicator round 1...then became every one's number one target and were eliminated quickly. However...this is not totally it relieves pressure elsewhere. Oh, they did do some serious damage to the war walkers game two. Once you learn how to deploy these guys and keep them safe from out flankers they are also easy to use. I included the 3 meks with big shootas for the same reason as I did in the burna squad, additionally I wanted them to have some dakka options if I had to move...this was a good idea that I failed to implement in practice.

Trukk Boyz with slugga and choppa: Yeah...these guys let me down for the day. My general lack of any ability to hit with any weapon beginning with the word "power" and ending with the word "Klaw or Fist" continues. To the point where for my lists, I truly believe I would be better off not buying these weapons at all as they are very costly and very rarely net me the reasons I include them in my lists. I will speak much more on trukk boyz later on. But, briefly these guys look like miniature Hulks but hit like scared infantry. Their low initiative always sees them strike last and suffer too many casualties to win an assault. In game 1 and 3 I assaulted two full squads into a 7 man BT squad(game 1) and a 9 man grey hunter squad (game 3) and lost and was run down both times. In game 3 I even accepted losing the assault in terms of wounds, but figured that the 8..count them 8..."Power Klaw" (there are those two words again) attacks would kill the due lived...GH's run down. To me that squad is better off with more guns and less upgrades. More on this later.

Mega Armored Nobs: Did what they do, but they don't do what they do very well versus CC oriented foes. I failed to use the Kombi Scorchas at all and could have put the points else where. Here again I believe an equal point investment in regular nobs is more efficient. Them being troops, however, is golden.

Battle wagon: A solid choice. Lived all day, despite being only one. KFF plus armor plates saw it never stop moving. Aarmo Plates (AP) is really a must. I am not opposed to putting more guns on this chassis despite common opinion...there were plenty of turns I could have gotten of a kannon shot or better yet a Killkannon shot.

Warbuggies: Only made it to the last list for the third round...did Nada...I used them very poorly nonetheless.

Warbikers: Again only made it into the last game, but did well. Their speed saw them bounce around to make the most of what they have. I could have been more aggressive with them. But they did help take out the scouts and high tail it back to help out later in my last game. They still have the "Rule of Cool" though and will see much more use in my lists.

Kannons: Nice little unit if you have the FO slots to spare. The ability to shoot a frag or krak is nice. Their BS4 and ammo runts make them hit fairly well....they will not last long with their low LD5..but that is why they are cheap.

Now what list should I have taken and why?

·         HQ1: Big Mek, Kustom Force Field, burna                                       [105]
·         E1: 10 Burnas, 3 meks with rokkits                                                      [165]
·         E2: 5 Lootas                                                                                                      [75]
·         T1: 10 shoota boyz 660, rokkit 10, nob 10, Big ch 5, bp 5, trukk 35, rp 5, rr 5, bp 5, rr 5, rokkit 5 [155] x 4                                                                                                          [620]
·         H1: Battle wgn w/deff rolla, rpj, ap, kannon,2 big shoota,bp[150]
·         H2: 3 killa kans, 3 grot zookas                                                                [135]

Total: 1250/1250 points

**The difference here is I let the natural claws on the Killa Kans do the fighting for me versus forcing klaws onto a unit that is poor in assault against anything other than units it should dominate anyway. The trukk boyz squads replace their sluggs and choppas with shootas which allow them to volume of fire targets from range or from the inside of their rides. No power claw opens up points for another rokkit and reinforced ram to ram vehicles and force tank shocks once the boyz drop off. Overall, more rokkits, more klaws (especially S10), more shots, and the addition of 3 grot zookas sporting 6 S6 blast templates helps as well. Lastly we squeezed a flamer on the mek to take those flame template shots of opportunity and not just let him twist nobs and dials ALL day long!

Round 2: 1750 points
·         **same as round 1 but add the following:
·         HQ2: Biker warboss                                                                                                     [130]
·         Troop5: 3 MAN's, 1KS/1KR/TL shoota, trukk, rp, ap, bp, rr, rokkit [195]
·         F1: #5 bikes, 125, nob 10, klw 25, bp 5                                                 [165]     
total: 1740/1750

**Here I replace Ghazzy (who I need more practice with) with a biker warboss. The MAN's are economized and arguably just as effective for much less points and remain troops with the warboss. The addition of the bikes add more threat dispersal, more volume of fire,etc.

Round 3: 2250 points
·         **Same as round 2 but add the following:
·         E3 12 Kommando's, SnikRot, 2 Burnas                                               [255]
·         F2: #1 Skorha                                                                                                   [40]
        F3: #1 Skorcha                                                                                 [40]
·          H3: #3 Killa Kans, groot zooka x3                                                         [135]
        Troop 6: 10 Gretchin, Runt Herder                                                        [40]

total: 2250/2250

** Here we get sneaky. Snikrot gives me a solid counter to the wolf scouts and long fangs. Also helps with armies like Eldar that like to hang back with certain units then zoom forward etc. The ability to come in WHEREVER you want is almost too good to pass up in a tournament setting really. Would have also had the option to attach the Warboss and bring him in on the back lines for even more extra sneakyness. The skorchas are for patrolling my back field, mop up, and objective contesting. We squeeze in a 6th troop choice for objective games or screening and 3 more killa kans with grot zooka's.

In retrospective I would have fared better on the day with the above list as it suits my play style and mitigates some of the inherent weaknesses of the Ork's while maintaining a mechanized theme.


Several things that jumped out at me about how I could have improved:

1. Learning to time the Waagh effectively. Knowing when to pop this off is pretty huge for an Ork army. Too early and you waste it, too late....and it's too late.

2. Improve procedurally. Deciding to shoot or assault is a tactical you do these things are procedures. If you do not learn the rules well, ask questions before you begin, or know your opponents army you will make the correct tactical decision however your procedure or execution will negate your efforts. Knowing which models to put in BtB first or using your movement phase to set up/guarantee your assaults is what will separate you from lesser generals in the long run. I need to remove the ring rust and get better at this.

3. Play more games. There really is no better way to improve but to play more games versus players of equal or better caliber. This is how you improve in almost any competitive environment.

Ok, let's talk finally about what I have come to think about Ork Boyz in general:

1. Take a Hundred or Take None:

No really. If you run infantry take a hundred or more. They die like flies. They are not good in assault...unless there are a hundred of them. If you do not take huge squads of them...and thus adjust your list accordingly than squads of Grots hold objectives better for much less points and Nobs actually do ok in hth.

2. The adage "Sluggas in Trukks and Shootas on Foot" is INCORRECT:

At least in my opinion. Many Ork groups/generals will argue all day...sluggas in trukks/boyz on foot!..Not so much really. Here is why...Orks may look like muscle bound xenos that can punch their way through a Rhino...but they really hit like guardsman...or scarabs...or nurglings...or skinny eldar... Yes they hit like a marine when they charge...but their I2 sees them go last almost all the time. Against anything I4 and above they go last all the time despite whether they charge or not.

The shoota is two S4 shots or attempts to hit all the time. In a truck...10 shoota boyz can disembark, shoot for 20 shots and assault for 30 attacks...sluggas can shoot for 10 and assault for 40...this is equal right? No, because the 20 shoota shots in reality come at I10+ as in they go before the assault phase even begins. The sluggas take casualties when they rush in and will never get the full 40 attacks, etc.  Besides the Shootas can decide to stay in their ride and light up a squad for a turn or two before finishing them off  and so from up to an 18" range...the sluggas?...can only rush forward and assault.  

My trukk squads will always be shootas from now on.

In fact this is how I recommend you run a Trukk Boyz squad: 

#10-12 Shootas, Rokkit, Nob w/BP Big Choppa. Trukk with RP, AP, RR, Rokkit...BP to taste: 155 points...167 if you go full 12. 

In my experience forcing a power klaw into the squad does not "Equalize" your assaults or help with vehicle the squad will die immediately after assaulting one and takes too many casualties when it does assault infantry for the power klaw to make a difference. 

Basically a trukk boyz squad faces two kinds of enemies in assault...those that it should assault and those that it should shoot. Those that it should assault...IG, Tau, some Eldar, does not need the help of the Klaw as it will win and hopefully mop up in your opponents turn without the Klaw attacks. 

Those that it should not assault...everything else...the Klaw will not make up the difference and is a waste of points as you take too many casualties going in and assaulting vehicles leaves you open to counter assault, flame templates, rapid fire, etc.

Lastly  I threw in the boarding plank with some of the points saved from the klaw as the S7 big choppa is almost as effective versus vehicles as the klaw in this type of attack for much less points. 4S7 attacks vs 4S9 on rear armor. The difference being 20pts ...PER SQUAD saved. 

While it might excommunicate me from the Ork community, this is my assessment. 

Additionally, in a list like mine really could run it with no Ork Boyz at all. Nobs are the best infantry CC troops you can take and Grots hold objectives with much less point investment (which leaves even more points for killy stuff by the way).

I will be examining the possibilities with this concept as we move towards finalizing a list for the 2100 Orks Project.

Thanks for the read,



1 comment:

  1. Excellent points Dan. I often feel that the shootas would serve better in the trucks. As for the first where it shines in the counter charge or IC hunting. When the unit eventual gets counter charged by the enemies killer unit the fist outshines the big choppa.

    I think it follows the 100 more idea you have as in 1 nob with a powerfist doesnt equate to much but its the 1 per 10-12 boys that makes a difference.

    I have had some good success with the big choppa in various units so you arent alone there.



Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...